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The Toad
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It's only an 87.6% displacement advantage, thankyouverymuch.

And besides - I thought them thar Bools wit' th' radiator-thingies only made about 145hp, wit' the lighter, free-er-rev'n' Kwacker knockin' on 130.........

Too much whining. This is a brand new series and there are bound to be some teething problems.

The big4 have had it their way for so many years that they don't know how to handle being no longer top dog. Sort of like the Democrats. All that whining and moaning and insults because they aren't guaranteed the podium.

There's no divine edict that requires racing classes be determined by displacement. Personally I'd prefer hp and weight requirements and to hell with engine configuration. Anything to add spice to a series where all the bikes have exactly the same bore and stroke.

As Quado said, "Open your mind..... open your mind... open your mind...."
 

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Didn't think the 600s were up to 130rwhp?
If they are running slightly modified rules from last years FX- yes, the Ducati 848, Kawasaki 600rr and Suzuki gsxr are right at 130rwhp. Little under, but mostly. Honda was in the neighborhood and Yamaha was getting there, too. It's really not that difficult to get into that range accoding to Larry Pegram when he ran the 848 last year.
Supersort is different. Completely stock internals would mean that most bikes are in the 108-110 rwhp area. Knowing that, it's probably pretty easy to see the extra 20 ponies out of the Daytona class, huh?
 

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Too much whining. This is a brand new series and there are bound to be some teething problems.

The big4 have had it their way for so many years that they don't know how to handle being no longer top dog. Sort of like the Democrats. All that whining and moaning and insults because they aren't guaranteed the podium.

There's no divine edict that requires racing classes be determined by displacement. Personally I'd prefer hp and weight requirements and to hell with engine configuration. Anything to add spice to a series where all the bikes have exactly the same bore and stroke.

As Quado said, "Open your mind..... open your mind... open your mind...."
Perhaps you right. You make a great point and you caught me being too much of a traditionalist. However, I liked the close racing that happened in the past in the Supersport class and didn't think it needed tweaking or in this case changing it to a preschool racing class. Three classes would be best I think: Traditional Supersport (600cc inline 4, 675 triple and 848 liquid cooled twins), Superbike (1000 inline 4 and 1200 twin) and an open class where anything goes turbo 600s, rotarys, jet turbines, 2000 cc Harley's, etc. or a strict power to weight ratio class where anything went.
 

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Snuggles
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When the little guy (Kawasaki) is only 600 cc and the big guy (Buell) is 1125cc (a 525cc advantage or a 88% advantage in displacement) . That's almost twice as much. At least Ducati only gets a 200 cc advantage in AMA and World Super bike. This whole Daytona class is a joke. I don't think Buell will play this up too much in their advertising cause its an embarrassment
Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the newest Kook model. Remember, this version of the Kook personality rides a shiny new Honda, likes horses, and has a girlfriend.
 

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6 posts n out

Girlfriend: Correct
Honda: Incorrect New Red Ninja
Horses: Correct
Yep 2 out of 3 ain't bad Bar :p
6 posts and I'm banned :eek:
My work is done here . Notice the view count went up and up.. when there was someone arguing back. :)
 

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Girlfriend: Correct
Or Boyfriend. I've always thought Michael Douglas as kindof a "Sissy Boy".

Honda: Incorrect New Red Ninja
It was a CBR1000RR, then a CBR600RR, now it's a Ninja? You hit two more sticks?

Horses: Correct
Total Lie. Horses and Motos do not mix. I'd still pay to see the beating all those "Rich, Beautiful, horse-riding Business-Professional Women" gave you when their mounts spooked as you rode up to the Stable. Hell, I'd buy Season Tickets. It'd be like an episode of Jackass.

Yep 2 out of 3 ain't bad Bar :p
Leave BrowningBAR out of this - he's just the messenger, you're the bad news..........

6 posts and I'm banned :eek:
Not quite yet.

My work is done here . Notice the view count went up and up.. when there was someone arguing back. :)
Hey, Socko - check the "view count" a bit more-often - it actually fluctuates up and down, down and up. Just like Global Warm... I mean, Global Coo.... Erm,.... "Climate Change"............

I still don't understand why you tie your entire existence to MO - if they banned me after this, I'd just give an "F-U" to the site, and move on.

Really.

I feel awful for you, that you have no life.
 

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One word for you

"I feel awful for you, that you have no life."

Actually, he has a lot of lives. He makes up a new one almost every day.
LOL Good point my life is complicated because of that. Last word on the Buell taking on the mighty 600s. Torque. You can't really compare power to weight ratios as say you really need to compare Torque to weight ratios This is where the Buell's torque kills the little inline 4s I am sure a GSXR 750 could smoke the Buell any time anywhere. The Buell is really a bully taking on the little 600s The 600s big brothers 1000s have no problem with the Buell in Superbike
 

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Super Duper Mod Man
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"Good point my life is complicated because of that."

Maybe if you acted somewhat normal and quit lying all the time, the complication would go away. Just a thought. Not that you could actually do such a thing. I guess negative attention is better than no attention at all, right?
 

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In the very same race everyone is crying about...an Aprilia RSV1000R ridden by Chaz Davies; Factory Aprilia Millennium Technologies Team, came in 8th with his team mate, Ben Thompson, coming in 37th. Therefore, the rules are fair. I also think if Eslick was on the Monster kawasaki and Hacking was on the 1125 Buell: Eslick would have been the winner again.
 

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MODERATOR X
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How about a Boss Hoss in the 125cc class? Or better yet, they run the 600's against Hudson Hornets? Love that twin H power...this is getting silly, who makes up these rules?

I thought racing pitted the same bikes, same displacement, same configuration, but with riders of different skills? I guess after the four strokes fouled everthing with motocross, put open class four strikers in the 250 class, anything goes now.

Does the AMA have the Marx brothers, Groucho, Harpo & whathisface making up these silly classes? Why not run elephants in the Kentucky Derby then, or have stock VW Beatles running along side F1 cars?

You have to excuse me, something is stuck in my colon again, that damn Crsipy Chicken sandwich in Phoenix yesterday, I might as well be choking down shards of glass...
 

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Premium Member
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In the very same race everyone is crying about...an Aprilia RSV1000R ridden by Chaz Davies; Factory Aprilia Millennium Technologies Team, came in 8th with his team mate, Ben Thompson, coming in 37th. Therefore, the rules are fair. I also think if Eslick was on the Monster kawasaki and Hacking was on the 1125 Buell: Eslick would have been the winner again.
I'd deffinatly have to see it with my own eyes to believe that. Werent they racing together in 600 suspersport a few years back when the rules were actually fair? How did both riders fair up then? Besides you have to take out the rider in this compairision for equality, and just look at the numbers. The Tourqe, the Hp, the cc's, all of it. In my opinion they should be racing in a bigger class. If it is determined the Buells have an unfair advantage they will add weight as Ace stated earlier.
 

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Gabe gets answer on the 1125 from AMA

Gabe- I pirated this to prove you are on the AMA case.
Thanks- Kirk

MD: Why is the Buell 1125R given such a large displacement advantage over other models (i.e. Inline-Fours, Triples and other Twins)? How do you respond to criticism that Buell somehow has undue influence over class structure and rules?

OD: The Daytona SportBike class is designed to allow the participation of a variety of two, three and four-cylinder machines of different designs. This eclectic assembly of motorcycles is consistent with the makeup of the class (which ran in past years under the name of Formula Xtreme, which allowed for machines ranging from 550cc four-valve, liquid cooled, four cylinder bikes to 1350cc two-valve, twin cylinder air cooled bikes). Daytona SportBike allows for a similar mix of equipment that is based on weight and performance characteristics that allow for balanced competition among a large and varying range of motorcycle designs.

Dynamometer, top speed, radar and weight testing has been conducted for all of the machines that are approved for competition in Daytona SportBike, and our experience over the first three races in 2009 has confirmed to us that we have been able to provide exciting competition among a diverse assembly of machines on a level playing field. The results from this past weekend have as many as six different brands of motorcycles in the top eight finishing positions

While anyone can criticize the classification of machinery for the Daytona SportBike class, AMA Pro Racing can assure any critics that all manufactures have been consulted during the development of the Daytona SportBike rules for competition and that no manufacturer has tried to exert "undue influence" during the development of these rules. No such action occurred and none would be tolerated.

The Daytona SportBike results speak for themselves. If one looks at the average times of the fastest laps, for the top two finishing machines from each of the brands competing in the event this past weekend at Fontana, the results indicate that the winning brand falls behind at least three other brands in performance.
 

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Buell Propagana Machine At Work: David Topples Goliath as Buell Racer Beats Japan's B

David Topples Goliath as Buell Racer Beats Japan's Best
"Summary
In a landmark result, 22-year-old privateer racer Danny Eslick rode his American-made Buell 1125R to twin victories against an onslaught of Japanese motorcycles in AMA Pro Racing's Daytona SportBike class doubleheader at AutoClub Speedway in Fontana, California. The wins ended a 40-year absence of an American brand motorcycle at the top of the podium in an AMA Pro Racing premiere class. Based in East Troy, Wisconsin, Buell Motorcycle Company employs about 200 people, making it much smaller than its foreign competitors." David Topples Goliath as Buell Racer Beats Japan’s Best - Buell Motorcycles USA - pitchengine.com
 

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Torque considered?

Gabe- I pirated this to prove you are on the AMA case.
Thanks- Kirk

MD: Why is the Buell 1125R given such a large displacement advantage over other models (i.e. Inline-Fours, Triples and other Twins)? How do you respond to criticism that Buell somehow has undue influence over class structure and rules?

OD: The Daytona SportBike class is designed to allow the participation of a variety of two, three and four-cylinder machines of different designs. This eclectic assembly of motorcycles is consistent with the makeup of the class (which ran in past years under the name of Formula Xtreme, which allowed for machines ranging from 550cc four-valve, liquid cooled, four cylinder bikes to 1350cc two-valve, twin cylinder air cooled bikes). Daytona SportBike allows for a similar mix of equipment that is based on weight and performance characteristics that allow for balanced competition among a large and varying range of motorcycle designs.

Dynamometer, top speed, radar and weight testing has been conducted for all of the machines that are approved for competition in Daytona SportBike, and our experience over the first three races in 2009 has confirmed to us that we have been able to provide exciting competition among a diverse assembly of machines on a level playing field. The results from this past weekend have as many as six different brands of motorcycles in the top eight finishing positions

While anyone can criticize the classification of machinery for the Daytona SportBike class, AMA Pro Racing can assure any critics that all manufactures have been consulted during the development of the Daytona SportBike rules for competition and that no manufacturer has tried to exert "undue influence" during the development of these rules. No such action occurred and none would be tolerated.

The Daytona SportBike results speak for themselves. If one looks at the average times of the fastest laps, for the top two finishing machines from each of the brands competing in the event this past weekend at Fontana, the results indicate that the winning brand falls behind at least three other brands in performance.
Right the Japanese are given a grim choice compete against the Torque laden Buell or go home. Torque is what wins road races not horsepower. The inline 4s may be able to match in power/weight ratios but inline 4s can't make up the torque/weight advantage
 
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