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Angry cagers = Trouble

7411 Views 104 Replies 47 Participants Last post by jmeyn, Jun 23, 2004

kpaul

Discussion Starter · Jun 17, 2004

Doing more.

I have similar things happen to me in Seattle on I-5 and 405 when I used to commute on my bike. I would be in the HOV lane driving 10 mph over the speed limit and be tail gated. Most of the time it was women in SUVs usually talking into a cell phone. I gave up gettng angry about it and just moved over and let them go on.

In this situation I guess I have to defend the motorocyclist a little. No one deserves to be hit with a 3000Lb + weapon. I am surprised you didn't get a little more involved by following the now felony hit and run driver and getting a better id Yes the rider was a jerk and maybe escalated the situation but deliberately hitting somone one and then running is extreme. Again I think you should of done more. If I saw a motorcyclist hit like this believe i would of gone out of my way to make sure the Driver was brought to justice. I guess maybe I expect the same from every other rider.

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3833

· #2 · Jun 17, 2004

Deescalate...

Although the car driver appears guilty of assault, if not attempted murder, the motorcyclist could have done much more to deescalate, rather than escalate, the situation.

In general, it is often better to let the a*-holes have their way, when it really doesn't cost anything. Pull over, let them pass, and hope that Karma catches up with them some other day. Especially when the ******* is in a 3000 lb weapon.

pdad13

· #3 · Jun 17, 2004

Re: Doing more.

KP, you can't blame this guy for not taking off after both the car and the Ducati and making a dangerous situation even moreso.

I do understand your outrage, though. There are some real sick S.O.B.s out there, in cars and on bikes, that have no regard for anyone else's safety. Especially if it's an inconvenience to them.

And, yes, I probably would have taken off after both of them and made a bad situation worse. But I've been known to do stupid things occasionally.

kpaul

Discussion Starter · #4 · Jun 17, 2004

No I meant go after them to get a better ... and to deflate things

plate number or description. Also to possibly stop a situation getting worse by getting the police to aother possible bad situation if the rider caught up with the driver. I would of never done anything illegal or physical. I would of used my cell to nab the guy.

torrnado

· #5 · Jun 17, 2004

with all due respect, eddyline, why the hell didn't you follow the cager and get a better plate number?!

i don't give a $hit what a motorcyclist does to instigate a road rage incident: NOTHING justifies a phucking cager uses his/her two ton vehicle as a weapon, i'll do whatever i have to to make sure i can help the biker up to and including using my vehicle to stop them. this cager behavior is inexcusable!

seruzawa

· #6 · Jun 17, 2004

Difficult decision. Especially in LA where there are so many drugged idiots (legal and illegal) and a fair number of armed idiots as well. Trying to follow in your own little high speed chase may just end you up in liability for the consquences if there's a crash.

I'm absolutely not saying don't get involved, you just don't want to make a bad situation worse. Reporting the make, model, color and first several numbers of the lic plate of an auto is enough for the police to make a collar. Even better if you can give a description of the driver.

You probably made the best decision given the difficult circumstances.

Mr_John

· #7 · Jun 17, 2004

Re: Deescalate...

I believe you should never underestimate the potential violence of both car and motorcycle operators who demostrate odd behavior. I have expierenced situations where just passing a car brought on "an attitude"; we all have. Usually I can tell the difference between having some fun on the road and the vibes that go with some drivers/riders. My opinion is to stay far ahead and watch your rear (we have a power and speed advantage), do a 90 degree, let it be and always look out. On the other hand you can also enjoy mixing it up a bit, we are bikers. Personal protection is also an option if legal and can be of some assurance in rare moments but of no use in normal riding. And by the way way where is the darn spell checker button on this thing?

Mr_John

· #8 · Jun 17, 2004

Re: Deescalate...

I believe you should never underestimate the potential violence of both car and motorcycle operators who demostrate odd behavior. I have expierenced situations where just passing a car brought on "an attitude"; we all have. Usually I can tell the difference between having some fun on the road and the vibes that go with some drivers/riders. My opinion is to stay far ahead and watch your rear (we have a power and speed advantage), do a 90 degree, let it be and always look out. On the other hand you can also enjoy mixing it up a bit, we are bikers. Personal protection is also an option if legal and can be of some assurance in rare moments but of no use in normal riding. And by the way way where is the darn spell checker button on this thing?

westcork

· #9 · Jun 17, 2004

Re: Deescalate...

It's always better to "deescalate". But what if you were the cager? Somebody in front of you is playing games. You need to get to your destination, so you struggle to get ahead of them and just put the game behind you. But the other person has the ability to get right back in front of you and continue playing.

You (us) need to do more then just "deescalate". The situatution could have been avoided by forgiving the fault of whichever driver instigated the problem. It's hard to swallow your pride. And hell, I am guilty of similar behaviour. But I guess this incident is a good reminder that things can get out of hand if you let them....

Nplateau

· #10 · Jun 17, 2004

I agree with Seruzawa here for the most part. Do the best you can, but make sure you don't make the situation worse and get yourself into trouble in the process.

L.A. is Babylon and it's not even about the drugs (legal and illegal). As a native Los Angeleno I can testify that L.A. drivers are the most inconsiderate assholes ever. And yes, I am including the cell phone chattering soccer moms, businessmen, teenagers and young adults. Sometimes I think L.A. is full of the most insecure, yet egocentric people on Earth. I mean who cares if someone is going faster and passes you. Just worry about getting to whereever it is you need to go. Too many assholes who need to prove how "hard" they are.

Sometimes I get the feeling that I should reciprocate their violence, but fortunately, better judgement takes over. Yet I must admit, sometimes I consider taking a wrench with me in my riding jacket just so I can smash a window or two of an offending cager. Of course I never do. Reason being is that I know I can get away, but I'm sure the cager will be looking for revenge and may take it out on an innocent motorcyclist. I couldn't live with myself if my own inability to take the high road resulted in another biker's run in with an idiot cager.

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32849

· #11 · Jun 17, 2004

yep

no road's so long it doesn't have a bend in it.

46879

· #12 · Jun 17, 2004

Aggressive driving is a MAJOR issue! I only ride 10 to 12 thousand miles a year on my bike yet I constantly have to deal with tailgaters, being pushed out of my lane, and cages passing me in extremely dangerous manner.

The problem is simple, every time you "just pull over" so that you do not have to "deal" with the individual you reinforce that persons behavior. Yet if you do not you put your life at risk.

The various police forces seem to be no help, in fact, I have had more than one "officer" tailgate me when I was on my bike, and in my cage passing in situations that I was taught was illegal (single yellow line on our side of the road, double yellow lines).

I hate to say this, but we really do need BETTER training for the various police forces and STRONG action against aggressive drivers. On a recent 80 mile drive down Interstate 45 I saw 3 different accidents, all rear enders. Traffic was not bad, it was dry. The only cause were people following insanely to close.

WE DO NEED TO BOYCOTT STURGIS!! The most serious offenders need to feel a bit of pain. Other wise we will just be riding on the shoulder of the road hoping we are not offending someone bigger than us..

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46879

· #13 · Jun 17, 2004

Aggressive driving is a MAJOR issue! I only ride 10 to 12 thousand miles a year on my bike yet I constantly have to deal with tailgaters, being pushed out of my lane, and cages passing me in extremely dangerous manner.

The problem is simple, every time you "just pull over" so that you do not have to "deal" with the individual you reinforce that persons behavior. Yet if you do not you put your life at risk.

The various police forces seem to be no help, in fact, I have had more than one "officer" tailgate me when I was on my bike, and in my cage passing in situations that I was taught was illegal (single yellow line on our side of the road, double yellow lines).

I hate to say this, but we really do need BETTER training for the various police forces and STRONG action against aggressive drivers. On a recent 80 mile drive down Interstate 45 I saw 3 different accidents, all rear enders. Traffic was not bad, it was dry. The only cause were people following insanely to close.

WE DO NEED TO BOYCOTT STURGIS!! The most serious offenders need to feel a bit of pain. Other wise we will just be riding on the shoulder of the road hoping we are not offending someone bigger than us..

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Vlad

· #14 · Jun 17, 2004

In Atlanta we have many thousands of individuals who commute (by themselves) in their multi ton SUVs. I, being a motorcyclist, get to use the HOV lanes. Once one of the a**holes in an SUV tried to scare me by pulling out in front of me, obviously pissed that I got to travel at a decent 50mph while she was stuck at about 3mph. The incident stuck in my mind, because, even though she was not trying to kill me, only scare me, think about the poor schmuck who's just joined the fraternity of the enlightened and is about 6 days out of MSF. He might have gone down just from her callous and petty attempt. By the way, for some real chilling info on the "impact" of SUVs on motorcycle fatalities, check out this month's motorcycle consumer news.

Francis

4940

· #15 · Jun 17, 2004

Having had numerous near death experiences with idiotic drivers in the greater LA area I can feel for the 999 rider that was toying with the cager. When I was younger and more impetuous I used to follow home the most egregious offenders home and confront them face to face. Most of them when confronted out of their steel cocoons were contrite and apologetic. On several occasions things got out of hand and became physical. Fortunately for me I am not a small man, and I did grow up in South Central LA. In retrospect as stupid as my actions were then, I never had the balls or lack of brain cells to get into a jousting match with a two ton automobile. What in the hell was Mr. 999 thinking? BTW kids don't try any of these blatanly stupid remedys with out parental supervision. VWW

pdad13

· #16 · Jun 17, 2004

Re: No I meant go after them to get a better ... and to deflate things

I know what you meant. I'm just assuming that to catch up to this psycho he potentially would have had to go speeding off after him. I'm sure the **** didn't just ram the bike and calmly drive away at the speed limit. And the guy on the Ducati, presumably speeding after him, would have been in the middle of this mess. This sounds like it could have been a recipe for disaster. I'm also assuming that the first reaction is to check that the rider was okay and not take off after said psychotic idiot.

Like I said, I know what I would have done, but I can't knock someone for being more prudent. He did get a partial plate number, and assuming he gave a good description of the car, the cops probably got this a**hole.

I would like to take this opportunity to call the sociopath in the wagon an a**hole again.

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kpaul

Discussion Starter · #17 · Jun 17, 2004

I totally agree. I don't care if it is LA. -

kpaul

Discussion Starter · #18 · Jun 18, 2004

In Seattle I things would be different

You make a good point about LA. Not to brag on my beloved Seattle but, in Seattle I guarantee there would be several people chasing this hit and run guy down and Seattle police or King county Sheriff or WSP would of nabbed him. I know LA is Babylon but I guess, my anger at the motorist would take over any fear. Call me stupid but sometimes one person can make a difference.

38500

· #19 · Jun 18, 2004

I live in LA and commute regularly on my bike. I ride about 12k miles a year. I must say that I have never had to confront an angry, a-hole driver. I have had to confront many *stupid* drivers, such as the soccer mom in a 10-ton SUV who cut me off because (I kid you not) she was *dialing* her phone and was not watching the road at all (I kept an eye on her, which saved me). I split lanes with good judgment, sometimes I hot dog it a bit when I commute, but I have never felt threatened, nor have I felt someone was out to get me. Quite often cagers even move slightly so I can split lanes better. Most dangerous situations have been caused by drivers who were too busy with something else (laptop on one's lap, reading a book, putting on make-up, shaving, etc.). I think that in the past 3-4 years I have been mad enough to yell only about 4-5 times and every time the driver looked sheepish and made apologetic signs. I would not provoke a driver, though: that would not be healthy. If I see someone driving aggressively and stupidly I try to stay out of their way. Maybe it's that my commute (210/2/110 for those who know LA) is not one of the worst. I guess my point is that you cannot generalize about LA. I think we have just about the same percentage of a-holes as everywhere else

Giulio

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sarnali

· #20 · Jun 18, 2004

I can't help thinking the guy on the Duc brought this on himself. Rule number one in street motorcycling is cars always win. period. It is absolutely insane to ***** with a cage while you're on a bike. getting angry and playing pissy little games basicaly ends up like this did, your ass on the ground and another MC hating cager driving around.

I don't mean to justify the drivers action in any way, and reporting the make/model/ license number is the correct course FOLLOWING an accident. but letting the son of a ***** go on around you and on out of your life is the best choice.

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