But it's too expensive and is more size/power than I need. And singles do nothing for me. When will BMW wake up and make a R750R priced at $6999? That would snatch massive market away from the middleweight standards market. When it's $5500 for a Nighthawk or 10K for a BMW, the choice is a bit easier.
Okay, first ride (looks very good - solid, confidence inspriing, fun) and price - 10k base, 12.2k ABS. That's 1k more for the base, but the ABS premium dropped from 3k on last year's model to 2,200 this year. That's still high, but better than last year. ABS on the F650GS is only $500, and I don't understand why the sensors, pumps and a control unit cost 4.4 times as much on the RR, as for the GS.
Anyway, my local dealer discounts a little, so the R-R is still in the running for me. I would need a windshield, but then it would make a pretty good all-arounder, light tourer for me.
The FJR-1300 interests me, as would the replacement for the ST-1100; but Rider speculates the FJR could be as high as 14k if it makes it to the US at all, and the X-Wing probably won't be that low, with a V-6, and who knows what other tricks.
So the competition is looking like the Bandit S for $7,400, the FZ-1 for $8,500, the Hornet 900/929 for ? (maybe $8,500?), the R1150R for $9,990. That's a pretty good lineup. I'd like to see the ZRX-1200S join for party, for maybe $8,300.
PS - thanks for the good, quick writeup. The Rider that came yesterday said look to the July issue for info on these two bikes.
They've been selling the R850R for some time in Europe, although not for as low of price as you (and thousands of others) would like. The price differential was only six hundred pounds less than the R1100R ( at http://www.cannon-bmw.co.uk/ ) . If you project that to the States, that's maybe $8,000 for the R850R, $9,000 for the R1100R, and now $10,000 for the R1150R.
I agree it would get them a boatload of market share to sell the R850R for $6,990, but BMW seems more interested in the small-share, high-margin market segment.
Do you really not remeber the R850R? It actually was a very competent bike, and siginifigantly cheaper than the 1100. I don't remeber how much cheaper, but you can buy a used one now for $5400-6200. New they were about $8,000, I think.
But I seriously doubt BMW would price a twin that low, and ev en if it was so cheap, they can't make enough to "snatch massive market" from the other manufacturers- even after selling 20% more bikes in the US in 2000 over 1999, BMW only sold 12,000 bikes. That's after 30 months of growing sales!
BMW is just uninterested in selling cheap bikes. There will never be a BMW described as a "bargain" or even as a good value. That's just not why people buy them.
Harley's are brilliantly marketed because they sell less bike for more money, and to it to a mass market, unlike Ducati. BMW just needs to lenghten its list of suckers.
I really think it's embarrasing to sell an 850 for less than $1000 different than the 1100. Why would ANYBODY buy the 850 if they're not going to get a lighter motorcycle and they're not going to save a significant amount of money?
Harley sportsters sell well in both 883 and 1200 sizes. Why? because there's a price difference. For less than $6000, you can get an 883 (with a few less extras) or for $9000, you can get a 1200. In my humble opinion, BMW should use the R850R to hook new members to the BMW cult, the way Harley uses the 883.
But I'm not in BMW's R&D or Marketing, and they seem to prefer the small numbers/high cost model of production, so it looks like it's going to be a decade or so until I'll be in a position where I can buy a BMW new.
I bought a BMW R1150GS and I consider it good value for the following reasons:
ABSII, Heated grips, Telelever, Paralever, comfort, torquey engine, fuel injection, integral luggage and hey - nothing else on the market look like it (some might say that's a good thing, but I digress).
Is it the best value? probably not. Is it the best at anything? hell no, it's just damn good at pretty much everything. I've done 700 miles days on it, had a ball riding it in the Vermont/MA twisties with the only limitation being my skill, not the bike's ground clearance, and on occassion I commute and shop for groceries. Once I get more comfy, I'll probably take it on gravel and fire roads.
Difference between BMW selling for $18,000 and HD selling for $18,000 is you get more for your money with a BMW than a HD. You get better techology, safer bikes, comfort and performance. What you do not get with a BMW is "The Harley Mystique", whatever the f*** that is. Also, a HD out the showroom door always gets a few more thousand spent on it for cosmetic purpose whereas most BMW owners spend bucks on stuff like Ohlins shocks, more lighting etc.,.
I hope that BMW will keep improving the technology and price it accordingly. Their market is not the same one targetted by the Japanese or HD and I'm quite happy for them to keep it that way.
If that makes me a sucker according to you, I can live with it.
I really want to love BMW motorcycles. I have even owned three at various times in my riding carreer. Unfortunately, they all had incurable problems.
The first, a 1985 K100RT, was slow and smooth as silk...on the left side. It made up for that by being slow and vibrating like a paint mixer on the right side. Right side mirror was useless.
The second, a 1988 R100RS, was a fun bike, light wieght and torquey but fairly primitive. The passenger pegs vibrated so much they put my wife's feet to sleep every time we took a ride.
The third, a 1992 K75S, was smooth but had a lean mixture "POP" every time I let off the throttle. BMW checked it out several times and said everything was AOK and that the problem must be my right wrist. Hmmm, I'm 100% confident I could have fixed the problem if it were carburated instead of fuel injected. Also, the ABS light started blinking. I took it in and the diagnostics said once again everything was fine. Obviously it wasn't so I asked how much to fix it. The dealer refused to give me a price quote. They basically wanted a blank check so they could just start replacing parts until it went away.
BMWs look like nice bikes but they are built so complicated now that even the dealers can't fix em. Addtionally, DON"T believe the ABS or any other system is self diagnostic.
Thanks for the BMW comments RKWXFD but I beg to differ on the complexity issues. Sans the ABS and the Roadster looks pretty simple. Two cylinders, no shims under buckets, easy access to the valves, no radiator and no chain. I believe fuel injection is simple and would not shed a tear if I never see another carburetor again.
I know Harleys also fit the simplicity bill but I'm not interested.
If you way that "the extra cost will be forgotten in six months," you obviously were never an impoverished college student. I just can't ignore $2000. End of story. And buying used is always russian roulette, because I have owned bikes abused by their old owners and it gets ugly. So MSRP really does matter.
If BMW made more affordable motorcycles, I'd buy one instead of a Honda in a second. Until then...
Hardly davidson does a gr8 ob of getting over weight underpowered peices of crap out to the longest list of eager suckers of any manufacturer. The only peice of crap bigger than a hd is a socalled new indian.
It looks to be an awesome ride, just plain brakes will be just fine. Although if you have the dough, the ABS is sure nice. I can't see selling my 97 black R1100RS, but it's easy to see selling off the Bandit to get one of these. But then, I still keep my eyes peeled for a great deal on a slightly used 97 R850R.
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