Buell Not Quite Ready for Prime Time.
My understanding of the problem, based on information to which I've been privy, was clutch basket failure. Apparently they'd tested the bike and were confident it could finish the 200, but decided to change all the clutches before the race. A batch of bad clutch baskets, with fatal casting flaws, apparently, were the culprit of every failure in the race. I think the guilty culprit was a japanese supplier. Oops.
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FWIW, I think that bike may be a collectors item someday. It's pretty rare and different.
"We believe weve identified the root causes of the failures at Daytona, but we need to do more development and testing before were ready to go forward with the production run," said Erik Buell, Chairman and Chief Technical Officer. "We want to make sure these bikes are turn-key reliable for privateer race teams."
When pressed further about possible future failures, Buell is quoted as saying "Fer Crissakes! I know it's a Fsckin' 'Harley Engine'! Will you Fsckin' get the Fsck off my Azz about it? Jesuit H. Fsckin' Kee-Rist!"
"I mean, why the FSCK can't you look at the fact that I took a Sow's ear and made it into a Silk Purse? Granted, a leather-fringed purse covered in conchas and dyed black and orange - but a Silk Purse nonetheless!"
When pressed further about possible future failures, Buell is quoted as saying "Fer Crissakes! I know it's a Fsckin' 'Harley Engine'! Will you Fsckin' get the Fsck off my Azz about it? Jesuit H. Fsckin' Kee-Rist!"
"I mean, why the FSCK can't you look at the fact that I took a Sow's ear and made it into a Silk Purse? Granted, a leather-fringed purse covered in conchas and dyed black and orange - but a Silk Purse nonetheless!"
After extensive study and evaluation I beleive I know the real reason for the failures..............
Not enough chrome and absence of handlebar streamers. Willie G.
Not enough chrome and absence of handlebar streamers. Willie G.
I know, I know. I befoe E except after C.......
I truly hope Eric and company manage to get their act together. I want nothing more than to see an truly competitive American bike on tracks around the world.
If we're gonna do this, lets go ALL IN, and whoop some butt. Otherwise, we need to stick with building poor quality street bikes and stay out of racing all together.
The embarrassment is killing us!
If we're gonna do this, lets go ALL IN, and whoop some butt. Otherwise, we need to stick with building poor quality street bikes and stay out of racing all together.
The embarrassment is killing us!
Of course, what privateer would pay for the Buell given the previous results?
It would make more sense to shanhai a mechanic friend and upgrade a CBGSX-ZX6r6 to Formula Xtreme specifications.
It would make more sense to shanhai a mechanic friend and upgrade a CBGSX-ZX6r6 to Formula Xtreme specifications.
There are too many sarcastic comments available here for our own good. But I think some fringe got caught in the wheels and fried the bearings.
Time for MotoCyzsz to come in and show us a competitive American Sportbike. Or for Eric to do a redesign and have another go at it, one or the other.
Time for MotoCyzsz to come in and show us a competitive American Sportbike. Or for Eric to do a redesign and have another go at it, one or the other.
I've no skin in this game but here goes anyway: you gotta love the sound of big twin racers.
First roadrace I ever attended was Road ATL in '71. While it was won by Jody Nicolas (CW editor at that time & on a Suzuki water buffalo based factory bike), what left a lasting impression was the Dave Aldana Factory Norton. Holy Exhaust Note, Batman! What a lovely sound. **** Mann & Gene Romero were there on Factory BSA Triples, too. While not twins, their sounds were equally GLORIOUS.[possibly interesting aside here: King Kenny was racing Yammie's as a Junior that day. Lets just say the success he went onto was NO suprise to anyone who saw him race as a JR]
Those twins & triples would make the most wonderful sounds especially coming under the bridge and backing off down the steep hill before that curve....ahhhh!
Yup, I want them to succeed based on audio alone. But then I'm an audiophile, so whattaya expect - good sense?
Yes, yes, I dated myself a bit AND shamelessly wallowed in nostalgia. But what the heck: great memories.
Another reason to hope the Buells succeed: Steve Anderson. How many times have I enjoyed articles he wrote. I hope "his platform" wins one for every article I've enjoyed over the years.
First roadrace I ever attended was Road ATL in '71. While it was won by Jody Nicolas (CW editor at that time & on a Suzuki water buffalo based factory bike), what left a lasting impression was the Dave Aldana Factory Norton. Holy Exhaust Note, Batman! What a lovely sound. **** Mann & Gene Romero were there on Factory BSA Triples, too. While not twins, their sounds were equally GLORIOUS.[possibly interesting aside here: King Kenny was racing Yammie's as a Junior that day. Lets just say the success he went onto was NO suprise to anyone who saw him race as a JR]
Those twins & triples would make the most wonderful sounds especially coming under the bridge and backing off down the steep hill before that curve....ahhhh!
Yup, I want them to succeed based on audio alone. But then I'm an audiophile, so whattaya expect - good sense?
Yes, yes, I dated myself a bit AND shamelessly wallowed in nostalgia. But what the heck: great memories.
Another reason to hope the Buells succeed: Steve Anderson. How many times have I enjoyed articles he wrote. I hope "his platform" wins one for every article I've enjoyed over the years.
I read that too, but the latest info seems to contradict that. If the Daytona problems were caused by bad castings, new castings would have fixed the problem. They've had more than enough time to get new castings, so apparently there's another problem.
Bummed
I'm bummed about this to say the least. The bike ran in the top ten at the 200 this year, given more development time it could run up front.
Despite the outdated stereotypes, the motor itself held up, which would surely baffle and anger the nay-sayers if they had an IQ higher than 75.
I'm bummed about this to say the least. The bike ran in the top ten at the 200 this year, given more development time it could run up front.
Despite the outdated stereotypes, the motor itself held up, which would surely baffle and anger the nay-sayers if they had an IQ higher than 75.
Sounds nice in theory, but has the 'Czysz even entered a single race yet? When it was introduced there was all this hype about how revolutionary it was and how it would take on MotoGP, then it just faded away.Time for MotoCyzsz to come in and show us a competitive American Sportbike.
The XBRR hasn't given any great results yet, but at least it's entered a race. Other Buells have been running in FX and other classes before that. They may not be winning, but at least they're racing. So far, the Motoczysz is all show and no go.
I agree, Kaw,Honda,Triumph, Ducati ,etc. make strides yearly to improve their product, Buell is an innovator, I wish Hardly would give him the resourses[$] and commitment to a 4 or 5 year plan to make America competitive and then produce it.
Re: Bummed
I hope Buell can develop a motor that can compete on a somewhat more level playing field with the other bikes in FX.
I would surely hope that a company as large and experienced as Harley Davidson could develop a bike with a race-only motor with a 233% displacement advantage that could compete with production-based bikes from other companies.
I can see giving Buell at most a 50% displacement advantage in a production-based (melting down and recasting the motor doesn't really count as production-based to me) engine.
I would love to see Buell, MotoCyzsz, or even Fischer (someday) develop and race a competitive American sportbike. I think it would help the sport grow in America. Like BruceF said above, here's to hoping Harley gives Buell the development money to keep this project going, and to develop more fair, competitive ones in the future.
By the way, not saying I dislike Buell, Harley, or any company, just that I think the rules were obviously bent a bit for Buell in this case.
I hope Buell can develop a motor that can compete on a somewhat more level playing field with the other bikes in FX.
I would surely hope that a company as large and experienced as Harley Davidson could develop a bike with a race-only motor with a 233% displacement advantage that could compete with production-based bikes from other companies.
I can see giving Buell at most a 50% displacement advantage in a production-based (melting down and recasting the motor doesn't really count as production-based to me) engine.
I would love to see Buell, MotoCyzsz, or even Fischer (someday) develop and race a competitive American sportbike. I think it would help the sport grow in America. Like BruceF said above, here's to hoping Harley gives Buell the development money to keep this project going, and to develop more fair, competitive ones in the future.
By the way, not saying I dislike Buell, Harley, or any company, just that I think the rules were obviously bent a bit for Buell in this case.
In his defence, Czysz is building and financing an entirely new motorcycle. That takes a few years. Also, he was building a MotoGP bike, not a formula extreme bike. Big difference.
Last I read, they were starting to work on the motor, either to refine the gsxr 1000 based mill, or develop one themselves. I would give that a year on its own.
Last I read, they were starting to work on the motor, either to refine the gsxr 1000 based mill, or develop one themselves. I would give that a year on its own.
If HD would actually get behind this in a real way, we could build a bike that is all but unbeatable. (imho) I'm not looking at hard numbers, but my guess is, right now HD has similar financial resources to the BIG 4.
Seeing Buell competing and winning in things like AMA-SBK, FIM-SBK and MotoGP would make be as proud as the day my children and grandchildren were born!!!
Perhaps we all need to pray to St. Rita, the patron saint of impossible dreams?
Seeing Buell competing and winning in things like AMA-SBK, FIM-SBK and MotoGP would make be as proud as the day my children and grandchildren were born!!!
Perhaps we all need to pray to St. Rita, the patron saint of impossible dreams?
Re: Bummed
Considering H-D has shareholders to please, throwing a bunch of money away in racing probably isn't going to happen.
They raced the VR1000 enough to develop a concept for the VRod motor and then pulled the plug.
You know how you make a million dollars in racing? Start with 2 million!
Considering H-D has shareholders to please, throwing a bunch of money away in racing probably isn't going to happen.
They raced the VR1000 enough to develop a concept for the VRod motor and then pulled the plug.
You know how you make a million dollars in racing? Start with 2 million!
Cal Rayborn won on this engine in the old match races back in the early 70s and the engine was old then. What can you expect? The Duc V twin was new back then and it has gone through about a million changes and is still current. That just hasn't happen with the old Sporty motor. Throw that steaming pile in the crapper where it belongs and build a damn engine that matches the rest of the bike. Eric, how can you be so smart and such a dumbass at the same time? Let's see, if I beat my head against the wall from this angle....
I should have added that I saw Cal (and Mark Brelsford - I think) at my first rr in '71. Sweet sounds, too.
But Cal sometimes won due to pure skill. And he had to leave to stay competitive. We all recall what came next....
But Cal sometimes won due to pure skill. And he had to leave to stay competitive. We all recall what came next....
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