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Let's not forget that Honda's automotive reputation rubs off on the bikes too, something that no other motorcycle company seem to be able to benefit from.



And it is a lot harder to argue that Honda cars are not high quality than it is with the bikes, other than Toyota & Porsche it sounds like no one else is even close.



(and I do not own a honda car)
 

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Re: What the F$%^!!!

First, it doesn't take balls to state your opinion nowadays. EVERYONE is doing it adnosium. Especially anonymously on the internet.

You seem to have a problem with people having money and enjoying it. For all you know the guy has been saving up for a long time for the bike. You are making fun of someone else misfortune and that makes you an a$$hole. You have stereo-typed him as having some Honda superiority complex when maybe he just wanted a big touring bike. Then you stereo-typed me as a Harley hater. I'm not a bike snob. I don't care what someone rides or why they ride. Most of my group riding has been with older guys on cruisers, many of which were Harleys, because most of the sportbikers in my age bracket are posuers and a$$holes that I don't want to spend my time with and with probably get me arrested or a trip to emergency room.

Why would someone who calls you an a$$hole need a group hug? Most people I know that are touchy feely don't go around calling people names like that.

On a final note, since by your first post that started all of this, you obviously like to stir the pot, could you change your screen name to

K lukam so we know who to associate you with. It just saves time.
 

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Sorry, I got here late, looks-like a good-one...

Anyway, here's my two-cents...

Case in point: Volvo was once considered the cream of the crop, when it came to quality. Now, after twenty years of other cars improving, Volvo’s just-another fine, (though, not exceptional) car. And, people know it! I have owned four Volvos; but now, given the choice between a Volvo and a Toyota (both costing $25K) I’d take the Toyota.

Also, Harley’s quality isn’t nearly as much an issue, with most guys, as the price. Say what you will, but apples to apples, you pay more but get the same with a Harley. Yes, Harley makes a very nice bike, but you pay a (ball-park) 20% premium for the name.

And, if anyone want’s to talk about arrogant…how’ bout, talkin about Harley-guys! I can’t count the times I’ve heard…"If it ain’t a Harley, it ain’t SH!T!" And…"If it’s Jap…It’s Scrap!" And (I really love this one) "Yep! Cost me $18K, and that was before I added all the extra chrome. Hey, I don’t care ‘cause it’s a Harley, and ain’t-nuthin better!"

Yep, who cares, if…your wife’s got not teeth…your kids got no clothes…and, your sittin there, drunk in a bar, trying to pick-up some toothless wench who thinks you’re cool, because…You gotta Harley, sitting outside…and, not a brain in your head!

So, if anyone wants to whine about how down-trodden the poor-folks at Harley are, because all-us, mealy mouthed, Jap ridden, pinko-commie-****, won’t stop actin-all -superior-like we’re-smarter’n-ever-body-else…BUY A F-CKING MIRROR…and, take a good loooog look, at yourself!

Sorry if I've offended anyone...who's not a stupid, self-seving, God don't the Sun just shine on my A$$ 'cause I own a Harley, IDIOT!
 

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Re: Sorry, I got here late, looks-like a good-one...

Well, Kevin, looks like you've pretty muched summed-up the point of view of the anti-Harley folks in a, ahem, enthusiastic way. Of course, the Harley folks see it a different way.

You've touched on some larger issues. I was just referring to quality/reliabilty. Let me also say that because Honda has had a few problems doesn't mean they're going down the tubes. There is some Honda resentment here, so naturally,when they have a recall a lot of people pile on. The fact that this is the second recall for the same (major) problem only adds fuel.

I think Honda still makes fine, top-shelf bikes, and probably always will. But other manufacturers have more or less caught up--sort of like what happened to Volvo, although I think they were better known for safety.

Honda itself may be an ever better example. Honda used to be the king of quality in cars. But while they're still making excellent cars, Toyota (as you've said) seemed to pass them years ago. Of course the quality difference between a modern Toyota/Lexus and a modern Honda/Acura is very small compared to the difference between an '80s Honda Accord and a Chrysler K-car.

Instead of jap-hating, everyone who rides a bike or drives a car really owes a debt of gratitute to Asian manufacturers. Without them, we'd probably have very different machines today (even Harleys). And I doubt they'd be as good as what we're used to.

I've got a ZRX, but I'm also thinking that Daytona 955i leftover is looking better and better. Who would have thought that 25 years ago, or even 10 years ago?

Thank you, Japan, Inc.
 

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Re: Sorry, I got here late, looks-like a good-one...

Very true. But they not only listened, they practiced what Deming preached. Isn't ironic that American manufacturers only caught on after getting their brains beaten out?

And as consumers in a free market economy (issues of dumping in the 70s aside for now), we're supposed to listen to our wallets.

How do you think the American auto industry improved? Do you think that all of the executives from the Big Three woke up one morning and thought, all at the same time, "Ya know, we've been selling some crappy cars for awhile because the American people have no other choice than to buy them. I'm in a good mood today, so let's build some better cars. What the hell, right?"

For that matter, do you think that's how Harleys got better? I'm pretty sure it didn't happen that way.

Wanna really be horrified? Look at the crap that the people of the old Soviet bloc were forced to drive and ride because they allowed no real competition.

"Yes comrade, I've got a beautiful 1990 olive drab, 19hp Ural. I must rebuild it every 3000 miles, and carry a bucket of oil every place I go, but it is made in the great U.S.S.R.! Let the capitalist pig dogs ride the decadent Japanese machines. Someday, after the workers' revolution, they will dream of owning a Ural."

Now think of all the excellent bikes we have to choose from today, no matter where they originate from.

(By the way, if I'm not mistaken, many Honda products, including motorcycles, are designed and built, at least in part, by Americans. The same goes for the other Big Four manufacturers.)
 

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Re: Sorry, I got here late, looks-like a good-one...

Actually I was too lazy to write out the long explanation that you did, but yes the Japanese HAD to practice what Deming preached because they did produce pretty crappy stuff in a war torn country in the 50s and early 60s. Unlike the American companies who became complacent with making money no matter what they produced...autos, steel, electronics, etc..... there was no real motivation to implement Demings ideas until better products mainly from japan kicked american executives in the butt to start competing with other manufacturers around the world. Imagine if a single industry in America would have adopted Demings statistical tools in the 50s or 60s things would look a lot different now....
 

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Re: Sorry, I got here late, looks-like a good-one...

So you go and make we write all that crap?

Anyway, I agree totally. American (and European/British) manufacturers had no real incentive to build anything better. Until the Japanese came along, that is.
 
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