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My insurance agent lists a sportbike with a driver under 21 @ $6000 per year.
Well, at least it's come down (proportionally) since then. That's only about half the cost of a new ZX-10.
 

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Being responsible is only half the battle. The other half is actually having some riding skills. No new rider needs a 1000cc sportbike to contend with while trying to learn. it's like learning to fly in a F-16 jet. Doesn't work.
Didn't you read his post? He said he knows it will only go as fast as his right wrist, and he takes it seriously. So, what's the problem?

;)
 

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The Toad
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Didn't you read his post? He said he knows it will only go as fast as his right wrist, and he takes it seriously. So, what's the problem? ;)
You tried to learn on a GSXR1000? Are you serious? Why do you think the insurance is so high? Ever been to a motorcycle junkyard and seen the wrecked race replicas lined up? Those bikes are too much for many experienced riders, much less a newbie.

BTW. Dr Pulley, have you gotten a ride on a Street Triple yet? It may "only" be a 675 but it's not like any of the 600RRs. The throttle is very abrupt and it is very easy to wheelie. Might not be a good learner bike. Would be a good second bike for an experienced USAF doctor, though.

Triples rule.
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·
Your dirt bike experience is invaluable to street riding and you seem like a level headed guy, I'd still start out with something a little tamer than a liter class sportbike though. Try a Suzuki DL1000 Vstrom or Triumph Tiger, maybe an FZ1 or 1250 Bandit, the new Kawasaki 1000 is also an excellent choice. The riding positions on those are more conducive to controlling the bike in traffic and street riding in general and are capable of pretty impressive performance without the sportbike cramped ergo's. Insurance will be less too.
Thank you for the suggestions, I will look into these bikes. Though some are harsh and others more understanding I do take what everyone is saying into consideration. I have been battling long and hard with myself trying to decide if 'everyone' really knows and my own personal feelings that you guys are just overprotective moms lol... On the one hand EVERYONE says it is massively impossible to learn on a sport bike, and that my dirt bike experience is useless.... On the other hand my logical thinking tells me... You've upgraded on dirt bikes over the last 10 years, and one thing you've learned is a bike is a bike is a bike.... No matter what the basics were all there... braking, throttle control, clutch control, shifting, balance... The only difference in each upgrade was more power and more weight... This as you say is different as cars are involved... not to mention counter steering... However I have a very hard time coming to terms with the fact that riding a 200 is so incredibly different from a 1000 that it means sudden death or as Moke said maybe not death, but world of hurt... No if's ands or buts.... It is hard to accept that NOONE who's every started with a streetbike has been successful... It may be true, however it just seems very unlikely. As I said though I am very torn on taking the advice of NUMEROUS experienced riders over my own logical processes.... Can this many people really be wrong? And if they were why would they be? Because they are over protective? Because they've seen too many noobs make too many mistakes that all new riders are thrust into the same category as them? I'm not really sure, but keep the advice coming and I'll do my best to take what I should from it and make the.... well I wont say right decision cause it doesn't feel right to me, but appropriate decision. Thanks a lot guys for your support, information, and continued overall *****ing :p

-Saki
 

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You tried to learn on a GSXR1000? Are you serious? Why do you think the insurance is so high? Ever been to a motorcycle junkyard and seen the wrecked race replicas lined up? Those bikes are too much for many experienced riders, much less a newbie.

BTW. Dr Pulley, have you gotten a ride on a Street Triple yet? It may "only" be a 675 but it's not like any of the 600RRs. The throttle is very abrupt and it is very easy to wheelie. Might not be a good learner bike. Would be a good second bike for an experienced USAF doctor, though.

Triples rule.
I feel ya. I know what you're saying. Problem is, this guy thinks he's different than everyone else. In fact, he is just like everyone else who think they can control a liter bike as their first bike.

I haven't ridden the new Street Triple, but I'd love to. That bike kicks arse! When I went to get my new bike, the girl at the Kawasaki store was trying to sell me on that old "it's not the bike it's the rider" line, and trying to get me to buy the Ninja 14. I had to pass (even though she was super-hot).
 

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I feel ya. I know what you're saying. Problem is, this guy thinks he's different than everyone else. In fact, he is just like everyone else who think they can control a liter bike as their first bike.

I haven't ridden the new Street Triple, but I'd love to. That bike kicks arse! When I went to get my new bike, the girl at the Kawasaki store was trying to sell me on that old "it's not the bike it's the rider" line, and trying to get me to buy the Ninja 14. I had to pass (even though she was super-hot).
Leave your libido at home when you buy a bike Pulley. I'd rather have the 14 anyway even if she wasn't hot.
 

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The Toad
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Thank you for the suggestions, I will look into these bikes. Though some are harsh and others more understanding I do take what everyone is saying into consideration. I have been battling long and hard with myself trying to decide if 'everyone' really knows and my own personal feelings that you guys are just overprotective moms lol... On the one hand EVERYONE says it is massively impossible to learn on a sport bike, and that my dirt bike experience is useless.... On the other hand my logical thinking tells me... You've upgraded on dirt bikes over the last 10 years, and one thing you've learned is a bike is a bike is a bike.... No matter what the basics were all there... braking, throttle control, clutch control, shifting, balance... The only difference in each upgrade was more power and more weight... This as you say is different as cars are involved... not to mention counter steering... However I have a very hard time coming to terms with the fact that riding a 200 is so incredibly different from a 1000 that it means sudden death or as Moke said maybe not death, but world of hurt... No if's ands or buts.... It is hard to accept that NOONE who's every started with a streetbike has been successful... It may be true, however it just seems very unlikely. As I said though I am very torn on taking the advice of NUMEROUS experienced riders over my own logical processes.... Can this many people really be wrong? And if they were why would they be? Because they are over protective? Because they've seen too many noobs make too many mistakes that all new riders are thrust into the same category as them? I'm not really sure, but keep the advice coming and I'll do my best to take what I should from it and make the.... well I wont say right decision cause it doesn't feel right to me, but appropriate decision. Thanks a lot guys for your support, information, and continued overall *****ing :p

-Saki
No one is saying it's impossible. Many people do learn that way and live. It's just a lot to learn to handle a bike that twitchy and powerful while also learning the entire new skill set of riding in traffic. The sky high insurance rates are a clue. Also your physical size will make most sport bikes a very uncomfortable proposition. Understand that you can read stories about people killing themselves on a GSXR-1000 in a parking lot. They accelerate that quickly. Learning to ride on one of those is akin to learning to fly in a P-51. Can be done. But you'd lose a lot of pilots. Your dirt experience does put you way ahead of a total neophyte.

At least try sitting on the bikes you are thinking about for a substantial period of time. Decide if they will be even close to comfortable enough. Whatever you get be sure to spend a lot of your early riding on Sunday mornings and in time and places where there is little or no traffic. First you have to learn to handle the bike. Then you have to deal with the cagers. Trying to learn both simultaneously is not a good idea.
 

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Thanks a lot guys for your support, information, and continued overall *****ing :p
Saki, the guys on this board are very experienced. We often use sarcasm as humor. This sarcasm is grounded in reality. The question is: are you willing to gamble that you won't make a mistake? And if you do make a mistake, are you willing to bet that mistake won't be seriously jeopardizing to your life and limb.

FWIW, on a different discussion board I'm on (Buell discussion board), one of the regular's there had a friend just die (approx. 3 weeks ago) while riding a powerful sport bike, that he had very little experience on. From what I understand, he was ditched from his bike and came to a sudden stop with a roadside object (? fire hydrant). It happens. Are you willing to bet that it won't happen to you?
 

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It is posable to start at the top, but not a wise decision. I rode 17 years before getting a big bike, and sometimes I still feel its alot to handle. Even after 8-10 years on the road I'd look at the barges at the shop & know I coldnt handle one & diddnt really desire trying, was content on my 800. It wasnt til about 2-3 years ago that I started thinking about getting a bigger bike, and slowly progressed to paying attention to them, then shopping for one. Then still droped it once then layd it down a couple months later. It's a slow process and should be.
 

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Saki,

As much as we are messing with you, we really have one BIG concern: we want you to enjoy motorcycling!

However, we've seen too many guys (and girls) scare themselves out of it. Several of us have lost friends and/or acquaintances because they were on a machine that they couldn't handle.

And there have been a bunch of folks that were lucky, and either John Law or the fact that they could no longer afford insurance made them get off the bike before they did themselves or someone else harm.

Your dirt bike experience will serve you well, especially when you have a traction (or more accurately, 'no traction') issue.

However, the biggest problem with the high-powered bikes you're lusting after is that they go very fast in a very short time. You need to build your 'street smarts' on a bike that doesn't change velocity (up and down) so quickly.

If you can keep the 'loud handle' down to levels a mortal can use, and keep the front tire on the ground, then go ahead and buy a very powerful, very uncomfortable bike.

Our collective point (have you noticed no one recommended any of the bikes you suggested?) is to go ahead and get a bike with more capability (power/handling/brakes) than what you have now. Get one that fits you, and that will do what you want it to do. Have fun!

When you have enough time on that bike to where it scares the wee out of you only once in a while, then consider moving up to a land missile.

(We haven't even started on the PPE (helmets/armor/gloves/boots) thing yet.)

I think I speak for all of us on the site: We want you to tell us, in a couple of years, how much fun you're having on a bike that you love.
 

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A Hugh problem with people who start on a bike like this is when they ride it for a year and nothing happens. That's when they think they are handling it, but really they are still only using 30-40% of the bike.

This I see happen alot when they go to a track, they see other riders on the same bike killin it. Once they realize how much of the bike they are unable to use,... They sell the liter and get a 600. Just remember that any monkey can twist a throttle and go in a straight line. Cornering is where you'll learn everything you'll need to know. To many sportbike riders put too much importance on what they are riding instead of how good they ride.
 

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Hey Saki and all others on this forum. I'm also a new rider and it's good to read the replies on this thread as they contain invaluable information.

But with my first post ever on this forum which will probably be longer than the introduction one so I'll bullet point were possible, I would like give some more things to consider as well as play devils advocate. Hopefully I won't offend anyone with my newbie thought process. I don't mind at all being labeled a newbie btw cuz I am, so take what I say with a grain of salt obviously.

Ok...so to be fair to Saki here are a few points semi-supporting his thought process.

1. A lot of people would say he's likely to get himself killed on a super sport and therefore a 250 is the right choice. But what about we all even thought about getting a Motorcycle at all? Didn't a number of people say to you that getting on a motorcycle PERIOD would get you killed real soon? Heck my brother and mom think i'm crazy for wanting a motorcycle. When i mention motorcycle to my mom she kinda looks away from me so as to not encourage my desire for one and I understand, but at the end of the day I have to live for me or i'm not really living at all right? Even after i've gotten my license and started looking into a purchase she thinks i'm in a phase. Wtv point is, we were all considered 100% idiots by at least one person before even an MFS course, am I right? I'd say getting on a bike with drunk cagers everywhere was the real challenge.

2. In fact, back in the early 1900's (apparently from what i've read) a 250 would be considered a middleweight to heavyweight bike that you only road once you got experience on a 150. So ask grampa about getting a 250 as a first bike and you're in for one long ass lecture unless he falls asleep first ;) (so yah don't tell him you want a 1000cc bike or you'll give the poor man a heart-attack hahah)

3. In summary, i don't think the difference between a Ninja 250R and a ZX-14 is the same as the difference between the SUBWAY and any street motorcycle.

That's it for support Saki, make sure YOU read the rest of my post at least :p

IMO, the reasons why those bikes are bad ideas just overpower the 3 listed to the nth degree, i just wanted to be fair to all.

1. Financially: I'm like you in the "I don't wanna buy a new bike every friggin 2 years so i'll just buy something I like" but that doesn't mean you can't find something you like in a more controllable package man! You say you want to keep it 4-5 years, how much do you think someone will buy your used supersport for after 5 years when the general thinking is that it's 98% likely to have been raced the **** out of??? From STRICTLY a money standpoint, you won't lose nearly as much on a ninja 250 for example as you will on one of those. You can sell a 5 grand bike for 3 grand easy, try losing only 2 grand on a ZX-14 that you'll more likely damage at some point. From a financial prospective it seems the superbikes are bad choices unless you plan to run it into the ground which doesn't seem to be the case with you.

2. It's great to be able to make a mistake (such as blipping the throttle) and walk away without a scratch to you and hopefully to the bike. That pretty much goes out the window on a supersport doesn't it?
Nobody's questioning whether you'll be able start and stop, turn left and right, pass safely, etc on that bike, but will you be able to overcome all situations as well as on a less demanding bike?

3. It seems your priority in choosing a bike are their looks. You didn't talk much about functionality of your various bike choices. Image won't help you on a smaller displacement bike and it sure won't do anything for you on a large displacement bike.

4. It seems you might be trying to impress your friends, but why? They're your friends and will want to see you riding for a long time won't they?

5. Is a ZX-14 all that much bigger than a 600?? I don't know cuz I'm not even considering a bike like that, so i haven't checked their specs (and i have class soon and don't have time). So is using your height and weight really a valid exuse to by a supersport? 500cc to 1400cc I bet there's not a damn thing different with them in size is there :p ??
I'm 5'11 150lbs and i found a nice full sized 250 bike that i'll hopefully pull the trigger on soon (gt 250R, ya ya ya, it may have issues right lol)

6. EVERYTHING everyone else has said!

Anyways, i'm late for class now (damn you saki!!) but good luck with your purchase choice!! Just be honest with yourself in all regards and i guess you should be fine. Friends mean well but they don't necessarily know what's best for you.

Bon chance!
 
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