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Discussion Starter · #1 ·

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Aging Cafe` Racer
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Washington State already requires blood tests for any accident involving a fatality, I don't see how it's violating anyones rights. Drunk drivers kill people everyday, as far as I'm concerned they should hang them on the Court House lawn until the crows eat them. This hand slapping repeat offenders crap doesn't do a dam* thing to stop them. They give up their civil rights when they endanger innocent people with their selfishness and lack of self control
 

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The Toad
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Seems to violate probable cause. What if you are sitting in your car and not moving after drinking three beers and someone who is sober except for taking Valium loses it and crashes into you... not an uncommon situation since Valium really screws up judgement. Watch the guy who is minding his own business get arrested while the Valium addled soccer mom waltzes off scot free.

I say, if you are going to test everyone then you test for any other common drugs, legal or not. Most people are unaware of how many people are driving under the influence of pain killers, anti-depressants, antihistamines, etc., that are just as dangerous as alcohol. Some don't mess with the motor reflexes as much as they screw up the judgment. Someone on Valium or Prozac might just drive through a red light simply because he doesn't give a shyt whether he kills anyone or not. Some of these drugs are known to cause homicidal urges. This might explain many of those cases of extreme road rage. Don't tkae my word for it. Check the FDA labeling on these drugs. Homicidal ideation is a side effect of many of them.
 

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MODERATOR X
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...feh, there is no law anymore..it's the law of how much money you have to buy justice. If I had enough money, I could have put that ahole who hit me in jail, but no funds=no justice. Welcome to the new US Monocracy, where you pay to play.
 

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The problem is that if someone has alcohol in his blood the guy gets nailed whether he caused the accident or not.

That's how the logic of the moral majority goes. If you smoke and you get cancer, hey, tobacco killed you. So what if many people who never smoked die of cancer.

We had just recently a big hulabaloo in Finland of deaths caused by narcotics. If you bothered to read the small print, anyone with a whiff of pot was classified as "death caused by drugs" even if the hapless dude was in the backseat of a Fiat Punto stamrolled by an eighteen wheeler.

- cruiz-euro
 

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The Toad
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USA alcohol...

The problem is that if someone has alcohol in his blood the guy gets nailed whether he caused the accident or not.

That's how the logic of the moral majority goes. If you smoke and you get cancer, hey, tobacco killed you. So what if many people who never smoked die of cancer.

We had just recently a big hulabaloo in Finland of deaths caused by narcotics. If you bothered to read the small print, anyone with a whiff of pot was classified as "death caused by drugs" even if the hapless dude was in the backseat of a Fiat Punto stamrolled by an eighteen wheeler.

- cruiz-euro
...accident stats are misrepresented in the same way. If only one passenger is drunk in a fatal wreck and all the drivers are sober the wreck is still reported as alcohol related. We also count people up to 23 years old as "children" in gun related deaths.

Gotta keep that agenda alive. Without those ever increasing stats the govt agencies and the related NGOs like MADD and HCI might get a funding cut.
 

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Wait, are you saying statistics are altered to meet the need of certain "studies"? I'm shocked.
We never use the word "altered" when speaking of Statistics. It's known as "Creative Interpretation"............
 

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...accident stats are misrepresented in the same way. If only one passenger is drunk in a fatal wreck and all the drivers are sober the wreck is still reported as alcohol related.
Alcohol stats have nothing to do with passengers. However, a crash is "alcohol-related" if at least one driver had a BAC of .08 or higher. This overstates motorcycle "involvement" because of crashes in which the rider was sober but the other guy was drunk.

But NHTSA does report fatal motorcycle crashes in which the motorcycle rider was at .08+. In 2006, that was 27% of all riders involved in fatal crashes, vs. 23% for drivers involved in fatal crashes. More here: NHTSA 2006 Motorcycle Fact Sheet (750K PDF).

It's possible for a drunk driver to be involved in a crash that wasn't his fault and to be charged with the DUI but not the crash. Former Raider running back Marv Hubbard had that unpleasant experience a few years ago, when some (sober) doofus was killed when he made a U-turn in a blind turn on a dark road, and Hubbard, who had been drinking, hit him.
 

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The Toad
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My favorite is...

Wait, are you saying statistics are altered to meet the need of certain "studies"? I'm shocked.
... the statistic that says that 10% of Americans have diabetes. I guess some groups think that the best way to garner support for their fund raising is simply to tell as huge a lie as possible.
 

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We never use the word "altered" when speaking of Statistics. It's known as "Creative Interpretation"............
The beauty of statistics is that you can structure the study to "prove" anything you wish...scientifically and without prejudice. Yeah right.

"There are lies, damn lies, and statistics." Sam Clemens said that, I believe.
 

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The Toad
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Yeah, but....

The beauty of statistics is that you can structure the study to "prove" anything you wish...scientifically and without prejudice. Yeah right.

"There are lies, damn lies, and statistics." Sam Clemens said that, I believe.
... it's especially funny when the lies backfire. For instance the methods used to calculate SAT scores have been changed twice to cover up the degrading state of public schools in the US. In spite of lowering the standards the scores continue to plummet.

Dishonety always exposes itself. Whether the average person has the courage to face up to the truth and demand change is another matter entirely. In the case of public schools apparently the public is prepared to accept any level of incompetence. The public is perfectly willing to accept the most obvious of lies as long as it makes them feel good and someone else can be blamed for their own lack of responsibility.
 

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... Whether the average person has the courage to face up to the truth and demand change is another matter entirely. In the case of public schools apparently the public is prepared to accept any level of incompetence. The public is perfectly willing to accept the most obvious of lies as long as it makes them feel good and someone else can be blamed for their own lack of responsibility.
I won't quote the source, as it might bias the reaction to it, but I learned something recently I found interesting:

In most European nations, the governments are afraid of the citizens. It's because the citizens are willing to risk general strikes, walkouts, and other grass roots actions to implement change and express their displeasure. The US doesn't have that attitude, at least not since the 60's and 70's. The citizens are afraid of the government. Also, we're so busy being good little consumers, and so afraid of anything that might disrupt our precarious cash flow, that we meekly accept any hogwash that's shoved down our throats.

That is a generalization, but I think there is a lot of truth in it.

Hey, wait a minute, I said I wouldn't put any political crap on this site. YOU TRICKED ME! I DIDN'T MEAN TO SAY IT!! NEVER MIND!
 
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