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It's going to come down to what riders feel about the peformance. If you study the dynos, especially the torque curve, you'll find that this engine is more like a '98 Ducati 916. It won't feel ANYTHING like a Hog. I mean, most Harley guys are gonna get on this thing, short shift at around 3 grand, and be sayin', "Where's the power at?!" Fact is, the good stuff doesn't happen on this motor until around 6 thousand revvies. Personally, I'd like to see this powerplant mated to a sport-touring set up, but I'd retune it slightly for more midrange power. As for the feet-forward seating position, I think that this is the wrong motor. Mr. Buell is going to be busy for a long time, coming up with some sort of real chassis for what seems like a cool engine. We'll just have to wait. In the mean time, I'll be riding my Duck!
 

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Re: Better than expected

ROTF! THAT is the innovative kind of engineering we need! How about some others: ... Well i dunno, maybe ... Gearchange on the handlebars, with a lean-angle activated clutch? Sorry, I must've had an American Ingenuity Bypass in my sleep.
 

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Actually, it's not that unusual for a 20 year old bike to sell, used, for about the same dollar amount, if it's in excellent condition. Of course, with inflation, and with the way the prices of bikes in general have increased, the $3000 you spend now for a 20 year old used bike, is a lot less in terms of real money, than the $3000 the first owner paid to buy it new.



The thing that sets 20 year old Harleys apart from many other 20 year old bikes, is that the Harley people take such pains to keep them nice, rather than riding them hard and putting them up wet. Even bikes that have had several owners, are likely to be immaculate. And immaculate bikes can draw the premium prices.

 

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Interested in seeing one.....not interested in buying one!! Put that V-Rod motor in a chassis similar to the XB9R Firebolt then not only would you have a competant American sport bike, but one that will give the imports a run for their money. It would be nice to have a native supersport that performs available.





...Erick Buell, if you are listening, (or researching your potential customer base on-line) do this and you WILL HAVE more sales. From what I understand about Buell's is that they have a great chassis, but poor engine and reliability. That chassis coupled with a V-Rod motor will have me selling my bike and waiting in line for such a unique machine.
 

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Depreciation isn't the whole story

Let's say you've got $30,000 to burn and can buy either a $30,000 bike that doesn't depreciate or a $10,000 bike that does. If I buy a $10,000 bike and put $20,000 in the bank earning, say, 4% APR, then 20 years from now, I've got a cheap motorcycle and $44,000 in the bank. On the other hand, if I spend all $30,000 on a motorcycle that doesn't depreciate, then 20 years from now I've got a motorcycle worth $30,000 but no money in the bank. Which makes more sense, if both bikes are equally fun?

Now let's compare a $10,000 bike and a $20,000 bike, plus let's say that your bank is hard on me and only gives me 3% APR. If I spend $20,000 on the HD, 20 years later I have a $20,000 bike. If I spend $10,000 on the "other bike," 20 years later I have a cheap bike and $18,000 in the bank. So even with those less favorable statistics, the "other bike" is still just as good of a financial decision.
 

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That's a great bit.

He actually says he wished the angels had switched to japanese bikes when they started making big bikes, but that now it's too late. I also know of some angels in CA that ride beemers when they're not wearing colors. What was funny was to see the Harley Krishnas' reactions, even suggesting he was joking, jerking peoples' chains, or temporarily insane when he wrote it.
 

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That's not true.

Everyone DID go nuts for the VTX, with the same figures as a big inch aftermarket harley without the excitement. I'm not a harley fan, but those big Merch and S&S motors with over 100hp and 100 ft/lbs are a kick. The VTX is just a boring neutered version available from a dealer and people made a big fuss. The Vrod's certainly more exciting than that. Not an engineering feat at all, but as far as vmax comparison it's got most of the power with half the cylinders and less displacement, and a real frame.
 

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Man if the jealously and crying get any worse, the page is gonna be wet and green real soon. HArley came up with yet another winner and everyone is pissed. To get that much emotion from a motorcycle shows they still know how to build em. Wonder why MO didn't report when the Beef Steak was hittin' the showrooms? LOL Keep flamin all. Just shows ya care!
 

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The first one in the area showed up at the dealer on Tuesday, and I saw it on Wednesday under deeply leaden skies that made it look very 21st-century. (Nice effect if you can get it.)



Impressions:



1. Looks good; high-tech and industrial without being the least bit bland, a lot like a Monster S4 crossed with a Low Rider crossed with a Mac Powerbook G4. Limo-like length. Looks better with someone riding it; the shapes balance out better with the rider involved.



2. Too quiet, even with the Screaming Eagle pipes they had fitted already.



3. Lots of very stout cast-metal pieces all over the place. Built to be dropped from an airplane without a parachute. How much does this thing weigh again?



4. That weeny little "fuel tank" (the codpiece between the seat and bars) is sort of a puzzle point. You know it's too small to hold gas, it looks a bit like a skullcap, but I'm not sure what kind of better solution there is.



5. Didn't get to sit on it, but it looks very habitable, especially for big Midwestern types. Instruments are overdone but functional, and the rider's position looked stretched out but not awkward.



I'm in the same camp with those that admire it greatly, but aren't necessarily interested in owning one.
 

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Excellent questions, Mr.Stormcloud- you hit the heart of the matter. Although rhetorical, your questions communicate exactly what's going on here: it's the simple fact that H-D is making this product that accounts for the major interest in it, NOT the specs or product performance by itself.
 
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